Most of that was brilliant. Loved the other Captain Jack and Ianto was suitably gorgeous throughout. I saw the ending coming, but it was still fun.

However, and here's where I prove myself beyond all doubt to be a heartless cow - why the flaming hell did they have to bring stupid bloody Rhys back? There I am all happy, and saying to myself "See, there is a TV-Santa", when they have to go and bring the boring sod back and then I probably broke the record for the number of times one person can say "shit" within thirty seconds. Mainly because the TV-Santa doesn't usually visit twice, so now they probably won't kill him again, Gwen will be all loyal to him out of guilt, and my chances of getting rid of him are practically zero. Grrr.

I did like the policeman. "Say I believe you - which I don't, 'cos it's bollocks - but say I do". And I loved Jack's dance, though I'm not sure how that would have gone down in 1941. Dodgy CGI for Abydon, but it is the BBC and still beats the time when the villain was basically Bertie Bassett. I wonder if Jack can die now, or is the Bad Wolf effect still in operation?

Rhys' arse, though? That's a cruel joke. I'm so desperate for hot male nudity I even got excited over dead Jack's little mini-gown.

I feel obliged to point out that the tv Santa actually does visit twice!

Though I do think the series wouldn't be as good if there wasn't the contrasts between the different emotional attachments the gang have.

Oh, they can have emotional attachments. I'd just prefer they were emotionally attached to someone better looking and less boring. I adored Will in the first season of Alias, for example. But tonight, if it had been less late in the evening and I had drunk perhaps a glass or two more of my leftover champagne, I probably would have done a happy dance when Rhys died. Of course then I would have felt incredibly stupid when the bastards brought him back. Oh well.

I suppose I just like seeing ordinary people on tv (and he was nicer looking than Owen if these things are the main reason for casting particular actors). And I liked that he really didn't have a clue what was going on right up to the end whereas it would have been easy (and lazy scriptwriting IMO) to get him involved by being taken over or something. I just don't want my tv too shiny (it wouldn't be British then!)

Apparently it's spelt >> Abaddon <<. Lucky Toshiko was so well-informed about the right sort of mythology. I quite liked it but I'm easily pleased when it comes to effects.

How come she spoke Japanese to her mother? Didn't she say her grandfather was living in Britain and had been here during the war (she said something about her grandfather and internment I think)? Which would mean at least one of her parents was born here too. But I suppose that's like wondering why Eugene in the dead sci fi geek episode had a completely different accent to the rest of his family.

More Wikpedia running theme fun - >>>A fly-poster encouraging people to vote for a "Saxon" is seen on the music hall. Mr. Saxon has also been mentioned in The Runaway Bride, and appears on a newspaper in Love & Monsters. <<

There was also a poster (or graffiti, not sure) saying Bad Wolf, which made a lot of geeky people (yes, I am one of them) on lj very happy.

I did spend a lot of the first episode being distracted by the purple shirt and waistcoat combo Ianto was wearing (has he always been that hot and I just haven't noticed?), but by the second episode I was in full geek out mode.

Every last one of the actors delivered big time. Eva Myles was especially brilliant at showing the depth of >>Gwen's grief over Rhys. No pretty TV single-tear-rolling-down-the-cheek crying here, it was very real and raw. Burn Gorman and Gareth David-Lloyd did stressed out and pushed to the edge fantastically, and John Barrowman when Jack >>went off to sacrifice himself to close the Rift made me so sad, the way he was just so distant and resigned to it. I know it's stupid because I'd read the Doctor Who spoilers, but for a minute there I thought maybe Jack actually was dead (although proving that I am irredeemably twisted it did cross my mind that John Barrowman made one pretty corpse).

>>And yay, Jack finally got not one, but two kisses. I am now utterly envious of Captain Jack Original Flavour and Ianto. But now I really, really want to know what Jack's real name is.<<

And the ending was both brilliant and a little sad. >>Brilliant because Jack got what he always wanted, which was for The Doctor to come back for him, but sad because he left Torchwood without a moment of hesitation or goodbye. I nearly died of sheer geek love when the sound of the TARDIS materializing started, I can't wait until I get to see Jack and Ten share screentime.<<

Given a choice between roaming through Time and Space with The Doctor and being stuck in a Cardiff cellar with a bunch of gossippy whingers, I don't think I'd hesitate too long...

Ianto would be a lot hotter without the sideburns (see also David Tennant)

Aargh, it's killing me not to click on those spoilers! It'd better be repeated tonight somewhere <waves sonic screwdriver threateningly at BBC people>

ETA Nooooooooooooooooooo!

Ah, now ordinary people are exactly what I don't want on TV. I'm a lot less picky about looks when it comes to actual live men. Not particularly picky at all, actually.

I'd put Rhys and Owen just about on a level, but Owen is interesting (and occasionally downright vicious) so he entertains me and may stay. It would be nice if he looked a bit less like a Weevil, though.

And yes, I'd dump the Torchwood lot in a second to run off with the Doctor. Preferably Eight, but any Doc will do. Except Colin Baker because that would just be silly.

See, I think you might be doomed to be slightly disappointed in Doctor Who etc if you don't like ordinary people on tv because that's always been what it's about - not just the companion-as-identification-figure but the people in each episode who find themselves in a terrible situation and then do the best they can (Mrs Moore or Ida or that maid who was really Gwen in the Unquiet Dead). The Doctor has never been the identification figure. They even did a Confidential about this. I think one of the problems with Torchwood was that they had all this fancy equipment and superpowers so it was quite hard to really get too involved with them - even Gwen turned into an Avengers gal after a couple of episodes (even to the not-sleeping-with-Steed thing). That sort of thing just isn't really British!

ETA 10.30 tonight, polarbear

Yay! Thanks, psammead! That spoiler photo linked a while back has brought with it some pretty high expectations...

The thing is, I never had a problem with the earlier Doctor Who. Maybe some of the people were supposed to be ordinary, but they weren't the grubby, boring, contemporary kind of ordinary, and I never felt as though the writers were deliberately dragging things back down. A character might be a teacher, but we wouldn't be expected to care about her mate Phyllis getting upset because she forgot to buy biscuits for the Staff Room. I resent Rhys for the same reasons I resented Jackie - because he drags the show back down and into the mud, and I want to see the stars. Plain old Earth I can see any time.

That's why I like episodes like #12 - it's 1940s. Time travel! Automatic +50 points. Hell, I even watched EastEnders when they did that wartime special. If they give me people and things I couldn't see as easily by walking down the average high street, I'm happy with my scifi.

I do prefer US stuff, though, in the end. Tends to be shinier. Though it doesn't have Jack. Either of them.

I see your point but that's a lot of what I like about the present DW incarnation and Torchwood. There's all this fantastical, dangerous, exciting stuff happens and someone finds time to wonder if there's any milk for tea or something. I find myself believing in the sci-fi elements even more because I can relate better to the characters. I like that they get that human touch. And I think it works because of the sensibilities of the shows.

I'm wondering about buying the DVD's, (says she as though as she actually had any cash for such purchases after the Christmas season). I know part one has been released but any word if there's going to be a box set at any time?

Um. Wow. That was. Well.

This show has been really up and down for me, but man, was that a killer finale. I loved the first episode, which I'm really glad was >>Jack and Tosh rather than Jack and Gwen (I like Gwen, but I think we sometimes see too much of her at the expense of Tosh and Ianto), and those little dribs and drabs we got of his backstory. Also, major love for other Captain Jack.<< Like others, I was a little sceptical of >>that last scene (really, how did everyone react after Jack and Tosh had gone through the rift?) but nope - really not complaining too much!<<

It was the character moments, rather than the plot, that gripped me by the end of the last episode >>(I mean, really? Random monster appearing out of nowhere for three minutes just before the end?), except, of course, for the final scene (incidently, Jack and Ten on the screen together might just cause my TV to combust). But Gwen's reaction to Rhys's death? Owen shooting Jack? The emo coat-sniffing? Owen sobbing in Jack's arms?<< All totally got me. DVD Box Set, you will be mine, whenever you make an appearance. GAH. Is it April yet?